The Transition After Sports: Identity Crisis

[00:00:05] You are now listening to Black Guy Therapy, a therapeutic podcast.

[00:00:16] Well, I'm gonna come in here like Steve Harvey. Well, welcome back to Black Guy Therapy. Yes, I know it has been almost a year, if not a year since we have been in the studio. Forgive me, it's not my fault. Blame Uncle Sam. Blame Uncle Sam. But, but if this your first time listening to us, hey, we're glad you're here.

[00:00:38] And for those who have listened to us before, welcome back. As you know, I always say, this is welcome to Black Guy Therapy, where we are a therapeutic podcast. We are a podcast designed for black men to just come and just take a load off while also talking about things that affect us in our everyday life. So we're glad that you're here on this journey with us.

[00:00:56] And I know I told you a year ago that I had some cool things coming and some good people coming. Well, even in my absence, I held true to that promise that I told you, right?

[00:01:09] So I got some awesome, awesome folks with us today who hopefully will be regulars on this podcast.

[00:01:19] And they have all the knowledge, literally all the knowledge, because I got a novel from one person's intro.

[00:01:27] We'll let him talk in a second. He might take the whole time.

[00:01:30] And you can hear him laughing in the background, but we'll get there, I promise.

[00:01:35] But anyway, Gerard, what's up, my guy?

[00:01:39] How's it going, man? Glad to be back.

[00:01:41] You know, we had a little hiatus there. We was on to something.

[00:01:45] And, you know, as we know, you got to take your time, do what you need to do, take care of the family.

[00:01:49] And now we're back, you know.

[00:01:51] So, you know, it's one of those things that I've missed really getting together with the guys, sharing their ideas, sharing thoughts, sharing a laugh.

[00:02:01] So I really appreciate you, you gentlemen, for being here today and sharing a good word with us so that we can definitely give the people what they want out here.

[00:02:11] So I think this is going to be a good one.

[00:02:13] Always, always.

[00:02:15] And I love that because let me tell you, Gerard has been on me.

[00:02:18] He would text me and be like, hey, bro, we got to get back on it.

[00:02:21] And then one of our listeners who I didn't know was a listener who is actually a friend.

[00:02:27] So if you're listening to this, hey, buddy, he was like, hey, bro, y'all going to make some more podcasts?

[00:02:32] And I was like, bro, I didn't even know you listened.

[00:02:35] But apparently he does.

[00:02:37] And we'll have him on one day, too, so he can talk some craziness.

[00:02:41] That's my guy, Lil' Ryan.

[00:02:42] I'm going to give a shout out to you, Lil' Ryan.

[00:02:43] You coming soon.

[00:02:46] But as Gerard said, we got some good people in here today.

[00:02:49] We got Ray back with us.

[00:02:51] So if you've listened to us before, you know we have Ray, one of our resident MDs, right?

[00:02:57] What's up?

[00:02:57] What's up?

[00:02:58] Yeah.

[00:02:59] How are you, sir?

[00:03:00] I'm doing well.

[00:03:01] I'm doing well.

[00:03:01] I can't complain.

[00:03:02] I'm happy to be here.

[00:03:04] Just looking forward to the conversation.

[00:03:08] And hopefully I can be of service and value.

[00:03:13] Yeah.

[00:03:13] Let's hope so.

[00:03:14] Let's do some of your doctor shit, right?

[00:03:16] Let's do some of that.

[00:03:17] Just hook it up, right?

[00:03:18] I like it.

[00:03:19] Because I told the people in the last season, I said, we're going to have a residential doctor on this show.

[00:03:25] You can't tell us nothing now.

[00:03:27] I mean, we already had one.

[00:03:29] I guess Gerard, technically, he's a doctor, but he's not an MD.

[00:03:33] But now we got to do that.

[00:03:35] So.

[00:03:36] But let me keep going.

[00:03:38] We have a couple other people in the studio today that I am excited to have with us.

[00:03:46] We have a Richard McDermott.

[00:03:49] I think I said that right.

[00:03:51] He is actually related to our residential doctor.

[00:03:54] And if you saw them, they look just alike.

[00:03:57] Except one's bald and the other one's not.

[00:04:01] And I guess one wears glasses too.

[00:04:03] But it's okay.

[00:04:05] We have him.

[00:04:05] Let me tell you a little bit about my man.

[00:04:07] First off, when I asked him for his resume, he sent me a novel.

[00:04:13] Literally, I probably could have put it in chat GPT and asked it to make a book.

[00:04:17] And we could have sold it on Amazon.

[00:04:19] And probably made good money.

[00:04:20] But anyway, Mr. McDermott Richard or Rich.

[00:04:24] I call him Rich.

[00:04:25] But you can call him whatever you want.

[00:04:27] Let me read his stuff.

[00:04:28] He works in the digital media space as a chief of staff.

[00:04:32] And he's also a licensed attorney.

[00:04:34] Got to keep one of them on the books.

[00:04:36] He's a licensed real estate agent, just like me.

[00:04:39] He's also a licensed insurance agent, not like me.

[00:04:42] And an active entrepreneur and business development professional in various industries.

[00:04:46] I don't know what they are.

[00:04:47] Maybe he'll tell us.

[00:04:49] Coaching and mentorship are among the meaningful ways he chooses to engage with communities he's a part of.

[00:04:55] And just to let y'all know.

[00:04:57] Because y'all know we be having folks up in here who have some type of athletic tie.

[00:05:04] He ran track at Wake Forest.

[00:05:06] So that's all right.

[00:05:08] My man Rich, how are you doing today?

[00:05:11] Wake Forest.

[00:05:12] Pleasure to make part in this.

[00:05:15] Thank you for your opportunity.

[00:05:18] Absolutely.

[00:05:19] Damn right it's a pleasure to be here.

[00:05:20] Because this is Black Eye Therapy.

[00:05:22] And we are a therapeutic podcast.

[00:05:24] Damn it.

[00:05:25] We're here for that.

[00:05:27] Also, we have another individual with us today.

[00:05:30] We're excited to have him.

[00:05:34] He arrived late to the studio.

[00:05:36] Yeah.

[00:05:37] Starting off.

[00:05:38] Look, he can't even wait.

[00:05:39] He can't even wait.

[00:05:40] See?

[00:05:40] He started late.

[00:05:41] He got here late.

[00:05:42] Then he just want to talk when he wants to talk.

[00:05:43] But that's okay.

[00:05:44] But we have Robert Jackson IV.

[00:05:47] And let me tell you about Mr. Jackson.

[00:05:50] He is a licensed clinical social worker who has worked throughout the helping space for over 16 years.

[00:05:58] He is also the owner of Peace of Mind Therapy, LLC.

[00:06:04] Remember when I told y'all we was going to have a mental health specialist on this show?

[00:06:09] I was like, if we're going to be Black Eye Therapy, we got to have a mental health specialist on this show.

[00:06:14] Well, damn it.

[00:06:15] We have one.

[00:06:17] Also, little known fact about him, or maybe a well-known fact about him.

[00:06:21] He also played football at Lambeth University.

[00:06:28] So excited about that.

[00:06:30] And love to have another collegiate footballer in here.

[00:06:34] I mean, not taking anything away from my track guy.

[00:06:38] But, you know, you dominated by football folks in this arena.

[00:06:43] So, how are you, sir?

[00:06:45] And I'm going to call him RJ.

[00:06:47] So, if y'all hear me referring to him as RJ, that's who I'm talking about.

[00:06:51] How are you?

[00:06:51] I'm great, man.

[00:06:52] Thanks for having me on.

[00:06:53] I'm really excited.

[00:06:54] And I talk to a lot of people about this all the time, actually.

[00:06:59] So, it's tough after college to even find a space where you meet men that are regular to have these kind of conversations.

[00:07:07] So, absolutely, this is valuable.

[00:07:09] I'm glad to be here.

[00:07:10] And I look forward to working with y'all moving forward, you know?

[00:07:14] I think he just told us he wants to come back.

[00:07:19] Yeah, I think so.

[00:07:20] I think that's what happened.

[00:07:21] And that's okay.

[00:07:22] We like to have it.

[00:07:24] Well, gentlemen, again, thank you all for being here.

[00:07:28] As y'all know, we have to talk about something.

[00:07:32] And I have all these athletes on the call.

[00:07:37] And I wanted to talk about something that I think affects a lot of people, especially collegiate athletes, even high school athletes.

[00:07:47] And that is the transition that you must take after playing sports, right?

[00:07:54] Right?

[00:07:54] So, obviously, for all of us in this studio, right, we all played collegiate.

[00:08:02] We were all collegiate athletes, right?

[00:08:04] But at some point, the athlete, we had to retire, right?

[00:08:12] So, that's what we are going to talk about today.

[00:08:15] We're going to try to dive into this, what I think is sometimes overlooked topic, about the struggles that we sometimes face when transitioning from our sport,

[00:08:26] the sport that essentially is our everyday life and is our identity, to becoming regular people all over again, right?

[00:08:35] So, with that being said, I want to start with you, RJ.

[00:08:45] Now, I know that you played football, and I know at Lambeth, they was all on you.

[00:08:55] They was all on you.

[00:08:56] That's what it was.

[00:08:57] They was all on you.

[00:09:00] No.

[00:09:00] So, then, when you transitioned from collegiate athlete to regular guy, did you have the identity crisis that many athletes,

[00:09:18] or did you go through the identity crisis that many athletes struggle with once they stop competing and enter the regular world?

[00:09:28] Well, I'd say to some degree, yes.

[00:09:31] Mine was a little different because, for me, I got invited to the NFL scouting combine.

[00:09:38] So, there's a big combine that said Indy, and they have a scouting combine that said Georgia Tech.

[00:09:44] I was invited to that one.

[00:09:47] And, for the most part, my family expected me to be like the – I don't know what they expected.

[00:09:54] Let me not say that.

[00:09:54] This is on Spotify.

[00:09:55] But, there was an expectation of what my role was going to be and supposed to be.

[00:10:00] And, when I decided, after praying about it with offers, that I would rather go back and help people where we're from, a lot of things happened.

[00:10:11] My girl left me, caught me unstable.

[00:10:13] I didn't know what I wanted to do.

[00:10:14] My family was very opposed to what I was talking about.

[00:10:18] I went from, you know, the great expectation of the family and everybody's coming to the games to a nigga with a college degree sleeping on his mama couch.

[00:10:29] So, huge identity crisis just within the dynamics of my family.

[00:10:35] And, then, with me, you know, there's no more touchdowns to run.

[00:10:41] So, exercising became a thing.

[00:10:43] What am I doing it for?

[00:10:46] My eating habits stayed the same, so I blew up a little bit.

[00:10:50] Like, a lot of things was just different.

[00:10:54] And, it all happened at one time.

[00:10:56] And, for me, I did a lot of it on my own.

[00:10:58] So, when I got into the helping space, I was housing homeless veterans.

[00:11:02] I was working with homeless and low-income people.

[00:11:05] I was working at the hospital at Vandy.

[00:11:08] I was doing a lot of different things.

[00:11:10] Yeah.

[00:11:10] It definitely was two days every day for a couple of eight years before I got everybody back on board.

[00:11:21] And, that's tough, right?

[00:11:22] That's one of those things, like, I think, and I think this will go with everybody when we get around, but, like, who am I without my sport?

[00:11:31] It sounds like you went through a bunch of things first, right?

[00:11:35] Like, who am I?

[00:11:36] Absolutely.

[00:11:36] And, you had to figure out who you were first.

[00:11:39] And, for the people listening, like, when you're going through that type of stuff, sometimes just that question can help, or not even help, can lead to feelings of loss and confusion, which can also spiral you into a bad place in life, right?

[00:11:53] So, yeah.

[00:11:56] I appreciate that.

[00:11:59] Rich, my man.

[00:12:00] Let me, how was that for you?

[00:12:02] Oh, thank you for the question.

[00:12:04] It's actually made me think about that.

[00:12:08] It applies to something I hadn't really thought about before.

[00:12:14] Yeah, I think it actually goes back to my school.

[00:12:18] At a pretty young age, I was able to go sub-50 and do certain things that would make me want to feel it.

[00:12:28] So, you was a 400 guy?

[00:12:31] 400 guy.

[00:12:31] You said sub-50.

[00:12:32] It was one, two, and four.

[00:12:34] I said sub-50.

[00:12:34] That means 400.

[00:12:35] Okay.

[00:12:36] So, and that was around, in a relay, around 14, 15 years.

[00:12:42] So, I think somebody had told me 48 went relay.

[00:12:46] So, that, you know, we don't use those times.

[00:12:49] That was a-

[00:12:49] He ran 48.

[00:12:50] That was there.

[00:12:53] So, that led to certain decisions to where whenever I went to college, I wanted to buy a store where I could just do my academic as well as my athletic.

[00:13:08] So, right before going to college, I took an academic scholarship because I think my senior year didn't go necessarily.

[00:13:18] I wanted to go and go and have a foot looked at.

[00:13:23] And ended up having to have surgery on an ulcer.

[00:13:27] Right?

[00:13:28] So, I couldn't walk going into trying to walk on the way to wake up.

[00:13:33] And so, yeah, relative ease to be a mom, at least a top runner, when he worked well, was able to go to state on relay.

[00:13:48] And then thinking, well, I can heal up from this.

[00:13:51] It's not that bad.

[00:13:53] So, I was able to get a surgery.

[00:13:57] And then one week later, I was back on my foot two weeks later.

[00:14:02] I ran 111.

[00:14:03] So, that's not being able to run.

[00:14:06] Yeah.

[00:14:08] I'm like, I'm fine for college.

[00:14:10] I'm going to keep training with me in the 10th.

[00:14:12] And I'm going to race out of the team.

[00:14:15] We had at that time.

[00:14:18] I think it was John Stone, Reggie.

[00:14:22] Reggie Austin.

[00:14:24] Most of them.

[00:14:25] Then when I saw him in person, I don't care.

[00:14:27] You know, I get to run against these great folk and learn.

[00:14:34] So, my trial was Chris was the coach, at least for track at the time.

[00:14:40] I think what's the heck.

[00:14:42] Met up with him.

[00:14:43] So, I'm going to be on track.

[00:14:45] And he said, you're interested in running.

[00:14:47] I'm going to run now, about $300 on track.

[00:14:50] So, I'm wearing that.

[00:14:53] Imagine, I still ran enough for him to put me on the team.

[00:14:56] But in my head, I was a second slower for every man.

[00:15:01] You imagine a sprinter.

[00:15:03] I'm sitting here on the team.

[00:15:05] And so, I'm sitting here on the team.

[00:15:08] Like, man, I worked my butt off for such a long time just to get to this place.

[00:15:13] Like, I'm on a team.

[00:15:15] And like, sub-10-3s.

[00:15:17] Like, this is my time.

[00:15:20] And for me, it became an identity just to push through.

[00:15:26] So, I managed around four years.

[00:15:27] And that's how I want to.

[00:15:29] And not knowing exactly what was it from.

[00:15:32] Later on in my life, I found out that it was a degeneration of my ankle.

[00:15:37] And then I also had a neck injury.

[00:15:40] I didn't even know what problems that was.

[00:15:43] I think at the time, I was benching.

[00:15:46] You know, whatever.

[00:15:47] I used to bench.

[00:15:47] And then I dropped 100 pounds on the bench.

[00:15:49] And I'm like, what's going on?

[00:15:51] I had a degenerative disc in my neck.

[00:15:53] And I got two of them.

[00:15:55] And so, I started to have less strength and all of this.

[00:15:57] And then still trying to hold on to that identity.

[00:16:00] And so, when you talk about transition, for me, it became, what's the, you know,

[00:16:08] what things can I use from this to figure out what I'm, you know, to what I'll make

[00:16:12] and what things do I have to give up?

[00:16:18] And for me, where I'm held on to my whole life, what point in my life, no matter when

[00:16:23] that was, I thought, I believed that I could be among, you know, the best at something.

[00:16:30] And in track, you're really trying to convince yourself that you could be the best in the world.

[00:16:36] Obviously, I'm glad I never had to run again.

[00:16:39] You've seen me.

[00:16:41] Right.

[00:16:42] I didn't get to run against Tim McDonough.

[00:16:43] And I saw his team when he was a World of Warcraftian.

[00:16:46] It was not a race.

[00:16:48] But I did get to see what that is.

[00:16:51] And so, that taught me a lot, you know, in regard to anything that, if I believed I could be the best,

[00:17:00] what could I bring to the business world?

[00:17:03] What could I bring to the motivation world?

[00:17:05] What could I bring to the hard times of my life when I'm going against?

[00:17:11] Is there anything like trying to be one in a billion?

[00:17:15] And I'm not going to get this done.

[00:17:17] So, those are the things that we talk about transitioning.

[00:17:20] Make sure I kept those with it.

[00:17:23] Because that is helpful.

[00:17:25] And it's not just for my own value.

[00:17:28] It's also true to others.

[00:17:33] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:17:34] I mean, I think as athletes, former athletes, right, we all washed up in here, in this room here.

[00:17:40] Washed.

[00:17:42] So, I think that that is something that we do.

[00:17:45] Speak for yourselves.

[00:17:46] What?

[00:17:47] No, absolutely.

[00:17:49] We know you washed.

[00:17:52] Look, you washed when you became a doctor.

[00:17:55] That's how I knew you was washed.

[00:17:56] No, just kidding.

[00:17:57] We love you.

[00:17:57] You are my favorite.

[00:17:59] I promise.

[00:18:00] Thank you.

[00:18:00] Thank you.

[00:18:01] No, but no, in all seriousness, obviously, us being older guys, the young kids will say we are washed, right?

[00:18:10] But there are things that we have taken with us from the game, right?

[00:18:14] We transition with the knowledge and power to do certain things.

[00:18:19] And we know that it was the game that taught us that.

[00:18:22] So, I like that.

[00:18:24] Gerard, I'm going to let you go in and go, my guy.

[00:18:28] What do you think about that?

[00:18:29] We're talking about the identity crisis, right?

[00:18:31] Yeah, yeah.

[00:18:32] Who were you without Tennessee football?

[00:18:35] I mean, you know, like the identity of being an athlete, I guess it's one of those things that was with me since I was five years old when I started playing t-ball.

[00:18:45] You know, like I started there, grew up, you know, it's the only thing I thought about.

[00:18:51] My mom told me, you know, if you don't do good in school, you don't get to play sports.

[00:18:56] So, I did really good in school just with those types of things I had there.

[00:19:00] My dad is a coach for a long period of time.

[00:19:03] I played all the sports in high school, basketball, football, baseball, and started at all of those.

[00:19:08] And, you know, that was just my identity.

[00:19:11] And, you know, I wanted to be different and always was smart in school, too.

[00:19:15] So, I kind of added those things.

[00:19:18] A student athlete was my total life, you know.

[00:19:22] When you get to college, right, you know, you get a scholarship, you come, and everything's looking golden.

[00:19:27] I do really good.

[00:19:27] My, you know, your freshman year, like, okay, this is going to be just a stepping stone.

[00:19:32] Two seniors in front of me, you know, I just knew that was going to be what it was.

[00:19:38] And then that's when, come on sophomore year in college, when things start to crumble a little bit, you know.

[00:19:44] Get into some harder classes, you know, start some that year.

[00:19:49] And then you don't start at the end of the year.

[00:19:52] Then you start questioning yourself when you're not getting to play like you thought you would.

[00:19:57] And then, of course, when you're playing Division I football, they start bringing in people every year to replace you.

[00:20:05] And then you start really questioning yourself.

[00:20:07] And you have to really, really hustle, humble yourself, and try to figure out, you know, what's your true path.

[00:20:13] So, you know, started some my sophomore year.

[00:20:17] Got hurt my junior year.

[00:20:18] And then come back, you know, they have a couple five-stars playing your position.

[00:20:23] So, then you got to try to fight to get back on the field.

[00:20:26] And this whole time, you know, like, trying to make my plans, of course, of am I going to get to play?

[00:20:31] You know, the coach is talking to you like, you know, are you going to be healthy again?

[00:20:36] And so, you know, time comes around.

[00:20:39] And I'm going to tell the world, Gerard, like, the five-star that came in was Eric Berry.

[00:20:46] So, if anybody's familiar with Eric Berry, that's who Gerard was, like, having to compete with every single day.

[00:20:55] Right.

[00:20:56] Come, I see I'm starting, right?

[00:20:58] You know, and Eric comes in.

[00:21:00] It's like, okay, you know, he's good.

[00:21:02] He's playing corner.

[00:21:02] And then a couple of games, I start the first, you know, two or three games of the year.

[00:21:06] And then they're like, okay, we think we're going to go younger here.

[00:21:11] And I'm like, man, y'all just told me I was one of the best people that we had going through the spring and everything.

[00:21:17] And so, that's, I'm in his, you look at Wikipedia.

[00:21:21] I'm kind of at the bottom of his, the start of his Wikipedia page where it says he replaced his fifth-year senior, Gerard Parrish, starting at safety.

[00:21:31] And then the rest is history for him.

[00:21:32] You know, he goes on to be a first-round pick, you know, top, probably top 10, maybe top five pick.

[00:21:39] Yeah.

[00:21:39] You know, just kind of those things.

[00:21:41] Soon to be Hall of Famer.

[00:21:42] Yeah.

[00:21:43] Yeah, exactly.

[00:21:44] Probably the best safety ever played there.

[00:21:47] So, when you're kind of competing and things just kind of happen like that, it's just the identity that you kind of developed over the years and wanting to, you know, move forward.

[00:21:57] And, you know, I always wanted to play at the highest level, right, just so I could compete and test myself and see how good I could be at all sports.

[00:22:05] You know, whether it was basketball, football, or baseball.

[00:22:08] You know, I had scholarships I could have played either in school.

[00:22:11] Of course, football was the highest one.

[00:22:13] But that was just my life and my identity as an athlete.

[00:22:16] And then having that taken away, you know, that embarrassment, I felt like I felt a lot of, like, man, you know, I'm used to being the man or being the, you know, the one that's really good at everything.

[00:22:27] Everything came natural.

[00:22:28] But the embarrassment of actually, you know, not playing.

[00:22:32] You know what I mean?

[00:22:32] You'll go back home and everybody, you know, you was the man at school, but now you're not playing.

[00:22:36] And then that kind of, that embarrassment gets to you.

[00:22:39] And then now you have a whole different, like, life that you have to embark on that you didn't think you were going to go down that path.

[00:22:50] You know, I prepared for it, but it's still something that, you know, you have dreams about playing sports.

[00:22:55] Even, you know, as old as I am now, it's one of those things that was so ingrained in me.

[00:23:00] And the only thing that I did since I was five years old and the only thing I wanted to do that it's, it's definitely a hard thing.

[00:23:08] But I think, and I was blessed to have a really good family and people that I could talk to.

[00:23:14] But I think at times it can be a very lonely place for you when you're with your thoughts and when you're alone.

[00:23:20] And that was your identity.

[00:23:21] And if you don't have anything else to hold on to, whether it's a career, whether it's another identity that you have.

[00:23:28] Again, I had school and scholastic work to kind of jump back in on.

[00:23:34] And that really pulled me through.

[00:23:36] You know, I was like, okay, if I don't make it here, then, you know, it's like CFL, try to do these things.

[00:23:41] Like, if it's not going to be the big show, I'm not, I'm not, I don't want to really, really do that.

[00:23:47] So I think the loneliness people don't talk about, the lonely feeling that you have when you're, you know, your expectations for your life goes a different way.

[00:23:58] And then you are caught up in that when you, and then, you know, those expectations of others, I think is probably the worst.

[00:24:04] Because you kind of see it come in yourself when you know, like, hey, you see it happen to other people.

[00:24:09] You know, when you were like early on, like, oh, I thought this guy was really good and now he gets replaced.

[00:24:13] Or you see somebody get hurt and then now they don't take their spot back.

[00:24:17] We see it on TV, so you know it can happen to you.

[00:24:20] But the others, you don't want to let them down.

[00:24:22] And then when you do, you feel like you're in a very, like, lonely place.

[00:24:26] And again, I think, RJ, you talked about, you know, stopping working out.

[00:24:32] You know, that happened to me too.

[00:24:33] You stop working out, like, I don't need to.

[00:24:35] Then pounds jump on you, right?

[00:24:36] Yeah, buddy.

[00:24:37] You get out of shape.

[00:24:40] Blood pressure starts going up.

[00:24:42] When them pounds start adding up.

[00:24:44] And before you know it, it just got away from a lot of us.

[00:24:47] And I see a lot of my old teammates, a lot of friends that, you know, them pounds got on you.

[00:24:51] And unless you make that direct, you know, talk to yourself that, hey, I'm going to live my life and be in shape and be best for my family to live life fully,

[00:25:02] then I think it still holds a lot of us back when you don't know that, hey, man, I really have to change my life and do something different than what I did the whole time.

[00:25:12] But, yeah, man, it's definitely a mental game that you have to play with yourself until you, you know, re-identify yourself as someone else.

[00:25:21] I feel every part of that.

[00:25:23] And I'm going to tell you why I feel every part of that, because I was just like you.

[00:25:28] And if people don't know, me and Jerrod, we both played together at the same school, right?

[00:25:32] We both played in Tennessee.

[00:25:34] And similar to him, like same kind of background, played all the sports.

[00:25:39] Well, actually, I didn't play them all.

[00:25:40] Played basketball, basketball, football.

[00:25:45] I ran track.

[00:25:47] But did all those things in high school, got scholarship to go to college, play ball, play receiver.

[00:25:54] And it was just like, thank God I had a parent who played collegiate football, right?

[00:26:02] Because he was at least able to tell me like, hey, look, every year they're trying to out-recruit you.

[00:26:11] Which means every day you have to do, you got to be at the top of your game.

[00:26:17] And I think that's what a lot of folks don't realize when you make that step from high school to college, is that every day they are out-recruiting you.

[00:26:28] And for me, that identity crisis was real because, like Jerrod said, you go from being the man, right?

[00:26:36] You go from, was it a big fish in a small pond, to being a small fish in a big pond.

[00:26:45] And, dude, having to sit behind somebody, it can absolutely mess with your identity, right?

[00:26:55] And I had to sit, shit, I had Jerrod Jones, who played for the Eagles a little bit.

[00:27:02] Lucas Taylor, ended up playing for Denver for a little bit.

[00:27:05] Denarius Moore, who played for Oakland for four years, five years.

[00:27:10] Oh, yeah, he was there for a while.

[00:27:11] Yeah, so, like, it was tough.

[00:27:14] And then we got the transfers.

[00:27:16] We got Kenny O'Neal, who came in from Florida State.

[00:27:21] You know, he had Josh Briscoe, which he played a slot guy, which I ended up moving to slot when, you know, in my junior year.

[00:27:30] So it was a little different.

[00:27:31] But just having to compete every day, and it seems like you're not getting anywhere, right?

[00:27:37] You know, they keep saying, shit, you better step it up or you ain't going to be here.

[00:27:41] And then when Coach Kiffin came in, Coach Kiffin meant that shit.

[00:27:45] He said, some of you will not be here when the season starts.

[00:27:50] And some people weren't there when the season started.

[00:27:54] And these were scholarship guys.

[00:27:56] And that's how Lane was running his team.

[00:27:58] He's like, the next level is the NFL.

[00:28:00] I'm going to treat you all like the NFL.

[00:28:03] So I thank God for Lane Kiffin.

[00:28:07] You know, a lot of people in Tennessee don't like him that much, right, because of what he did.

[00:28:12] But Lane, just the way Lane ran his program was able to get me on track.

[00:28:21] Because at that point, I knew, okay, I got to get out of my damn feelings.

[00:28:26] And I got to get on this bus.

[00:28:28] Because if not, I ain't going to be on this team.

[00:28:31] And I think, again, a lot of people don't understand.

[00:28:34] Like, if you ain't never, if you coming from a small country school or just a school, you know, you're not, you don't have somebody who can tell you what or how, like, college is a business.

[00:28:47] You won't make it.

[00:28:49] It'll chew you up and spit you out.

[00:28:51] So I didn't have that bad of a, I guess I didn't have that bad of a identity crisis after I was done playing.

[00:28:58] Because my dad, and my dad's an educator.

[00:29:02] He's a college athlete and he was an educator.

[00:29:04] So he knew, like, he always instilled in me like, hey, make sure you get your degree.

[00:29:09] Hey, you got to get your degree.

[00:29:11] Hey, all right, you're going to get your master's now.

[00:29:12] Hey, you're here, you're going to get this degree.

[00:29:14] Because that's something you take with you outside of sports.

[00:29:19] I think, I think I can speak for us all.

[00:29:21] And Ray, I'm going to let you talk here in a second.

[00:29:23] I ain't forgot about you.

[00:29:27] But I think I can speak for us all when I, when I say after playing at the collegiate level, right, it's almost like you lost a part of yourself.

[00:29:38] Or not even almost, you lost a part of yourself.

[00:29:41] And you had to go find yourself and find what your new purpose was.

[00:29:46] And for many, for many, that is hard.

[00:29:51] Yes, we know.

[00:29:52] Yeah, yeah, we've all been there, right?

[00:29:54] I know some people who still struggle with that.

[00:29:57] Absolutely.

[00:29:58] And they've been out of it for 10, 15 years.

[00:30:00] And they're still kind of struggling to find their way after football or basketball has ended.

[00:30:06] And that's one of those things that I think as a, as universities go and they get this NIL, one of the things they can help with more is trying to help people identify that.

[00:30:20] That length of time after, after sports, maybe make it, that's your business.

[00:30:27] You know what I mean?

[00:30:27] Start making that the business before you leave.

[00:30:30] Is sports as being a business if you love it that much.

[00:30:33] And showing you the different, like, things you can actually do in sports.

[00:30:38] Because there's so many jobs that are there that are unique.

[00:30:41] And that a lot of our teammates would, or ourselves even, would have been great at if we even knew about some of those things that you could do.

[00:30:50] Nobody told you you could be a GM of a team and the path that it took to get there.

[00:30:54] No one told you, you know, you could be the media relations person, you know.

[00:30:59] But a lot of us, if we had been told, like, hey man, this is a path for you.

[00:31:03] After you get out, take these classes.

[00:31:05] You know, kind of work with the people that's already at the school.

[00:31:08] That you could have saw a lot more success and you still would have been around the game.

[00:31:12] And I think that landing spot would have been a lot, a lot softer.

[00:31:15] And I think a lot of us could have done better with that.

[00:31:19] Yeah.

[00:31:23] Yeah, Ray.

[00:31:24] Ray, Ray, it's your turn now.

[00:31:26] Okay, okay.

[00:31:27] First of all, I just want to say thank you for having me.

[00:31:30] I appreciate being in such illustrious company.

[00:31:35] Man, stop, stop, stop, stop.

[00:31:37] No, I gotta be, I'm being real with it, man.

[00:31:41] Like, so Richard's my brother.

[00:31:42] Richard got me by five years, even though he, I don't, he don't look it now because I got all the grays now.

[00:31:48] But, but it was kind of hard coming up.

[00:31:51] I feel like, and this is something I don't really talk about much because I don't really feel like I have that many spaces to talk about it.

[00:31:56] Like, y'all, you guys, God, God bless you.

[00:31:59] Y'all got to go compete at the collegiate level.

[00:32:01] So my athletic career got cut off at the high school level.

[00:32:05] And it wasn't because I didn't train.

[00:32:07] I trained every day.

[00:32:08] I ate right.

[00:32:09] I was the top athlete on my team.

[00:32:11] My body deteriorated early.

[00:32:13] I was born with flat feet at Pro Nation.

[00:32:16] And I got to a point to where my spike plate didn't line up with my foot strike.

[00:32:21] And I was getting faster and faster on my 60.

[00:32:24] My 300 was coming down.

[00:32:25] I was running with, with two pound weights in my arms going around on the 300.

[00:32:29] Like I was getting, everything was like falling in line, falling in line for progression.

[00:32:32] And then bam, got hurt.

[00:32:34] And that was about junior year.

[00:32:36] And then come senior year, I couldn't even do track anymore.

[00:32:40] Basketball ended for me early.

[00:32:42] I had more probably prospects in track than basketball.

[00:32:45] And the other, I think, weird caveat is like basketball is probably my favorite sport.

[00:32:49] I love multiple sports.

[00:32:51] When Gerard mentioned T-ball, like I was the number one guy on my T-ball team, like from day one.

[00:32:57] So that's how I knew myself.

[00:32:58] Like I'm an athlete.

[00:32:59] Like my first T-ball game.

[00:33:01] On T-ball though.

[00:33:01] Number one on T-ball, y'all.

[00:33:03] I'm talking about T-ball.

[00:33:03] I know, I know.

[00:33:04] Yeah, it all starts with T-ball, man.

[00:33:05] All-star T-ball, number one.

[00:33:08] When you know you have that gene in you though.

[00:33:10] But like I showed up late to my first T-ball game.

[00:33:13] My coach rushed me in.

[00:33:15] My first swipe was a home run.

[00:33:17] And I left the guy that was in front of me.

[00:33:19] And they ended up calling me out.

[00:33:20] Because I didn't know.

[00:33:22] They didn't know that anybody could run that fast that they would pass their teammate.

[00:33:25] But I did.

[00:33:26] So it was like I started there.

[00:33:29] And like I had to actively die onto all of those aspirations.

[00:33:35] Because I wanted to go to the NBA.

[00:33:37] That wasn't going to happen.

[00:33:38] I want to at least get to the States in track.

[00:33:40] That ain't going to happen.

[00:33:41] I wanted to go to college.

[00:33:42] I wanted to do all of these things.

[00:33:43] I was working just as hard alongside with all those people that were doing it.

[00:33:48] And they knew.

[00:33:49] And they saw me there.

[00:33:49] And they loved me.

[00:33:50] And they remember.

[00:33:50] And had to.

[00:33:51] All of that had to die in high school.

[00:33:54] And then I had surgery.

[00:33:55] And they had to die again.

[00:33:57] So it was like I had to mourn all those versions of myself before I even got there.

[00:34:03] And luckily you know God gave me other talents like art, music, all these other things.

[00:34:09] But the thing that I ultimately had to ask myself was what is my purpose?

[00:34:15] And how does God help me find an overarching purpose?

[00:34:20] And that purpose was healing.

[00:34:22] So no matter what I did if it was going to be music then there has to be a healing element to it.

[00:34:28] If it's going to be art there has to be a healing element to it.

[00:34:30] If it's going to be selling somebody something it has to be a healing.

[00:34:33] So everything has to go back to healing in some way because everything needs to connect back to God.

[00:34:38] And when I found out like okay whatever I do is going to be about that purpose.

[00:34:43] It didn't matter if you call me doctor, rapper, businessman.

[00:34:48] I don't care whatever because I don't identify by that.

[00:34:51] I'm a healer.

[00:34:53] I'm with God.

[00:34:54] So I happen to have an MD.

[00:34:56] I happen to be a radiologist.

[00:34:58] But it doesn't matter because I'm a healer.

[00:34:59] So that's why I can talk psychology, sociology, all those other things because I'm here for healing.

[00:35:06] And to me like having that more centering purpose helped me you know molt all those other skins that I used to be.

[00:35:16] Because you have to go through all those other those experiences in order to become the more complete and comprehensive person that you are today.

[00:35:24] Because and you're going to have way more to offer to everybody coming behind you too.

[00:35:27] And the one thing I just wanted to add on to you.

[00:35:30] I love how y'all said how they keep on trying to out recruit you.

[00:35:34] Right.

[00:35:34] They keep on trying to find that next man up even in academics.

[00:35:38] Like so I wasn't I wasn't I wasn't an athlete at UT, but I was on the academic side of UT before you guys came in.

[00:35:44] And I remember having like my my scholarship.

[00:35:47] I had the African-American scholarship award or whatever they had at that time.

[00:35:51] Oh, yeah.

[00:35:52] African-American Achievers Grant.

[00:35:53] Exactly.

[00:35:54] Right.

[00:35:54] And you had to maintain like a 3.0 to keep it at the time I had it.

[00:36:00] And I think one semester I had a 3.1, but it was really a 3.4.

[00:36:05] I forgot to withdraw from a class.

[00:36:07] And then you get an automatic withdrawal, no questions asked.

[00:36:09] But they tried to do some politics thing where they said, well, it was 2.8 when we checked it.

[00:36:14] It was never, ever 2.8.

[00:36:15] And at that point, I realized, oh, y'all just got us on this mill here that y'all keep running.

[00:36:20] And you're trying to you're trying to take the scholarship you gave me, take it away from me and give it to the next unsuspecting young black man or black female and do the same thing and rinse and repeat so you can meet your quota.

[00:36:30] And that's the business of college on the other end.

[00:36:32] You have the athletic business where they're trying to replace you and you have the academic business where they're trying to replace you and meet that quota and keep it moving.

[00:36:39] So once I learned that, I was like, oh, I need to make this business work in my favor because they're trying to pimp me.

[00:36:45] I got to pimp them and get my degree.

[00:36:47] So I agree with everything you're saying because if you ain't looking out and seeing how the game is being played, they going to play you and run you through the grinder.

[00:36:59] Absolutely.

[00:37:00] Absolutely.

[00:37:01] Man, that's so strong there, Ray.

[00:37:03] Thanks for sharing that, man.

[00:37:05] I'm so proud of it and glad that this is a space that we can share these things.

[00:37:09] I feel like at times as athletes and former athletes, we don't get to share our struggles and our opinions.

[00:37:15] So this is a good space.

[00:37:16] It's how I like to say therapeutic podcast because talking about things oftentimes is like a release for you all and for myself as well.

[00:37:25] So thank you all, man, for sharing that because I know sometimes it can bring up wounds.

[00:37:29] And, you know, like you said, you spent hours and hours and blood and sweat and tears and trying to do these things, being tough, being crying about these things.

[00:37:42] And then to have some of that come back, you know, it's definitely therapeutic, but also can be hard.

[00:37:47] So thanks for sharing that.

[00:37:50] Oh, it was many nights I cried.

[00:37:53] Many nights I cried and many nights I drank until I probably didn't need to.

[00:37:59] Oh, yeah.

[00:38:01] Probably.

[00:38:03] Yeah.

[00:38:05] Yeah.

[00:38:05] So, you know, I want to move on to one other thing here.

[00:38:11] Well, depending on how much time.

[00:38:12] I know I think, Richard, you had a question, didn't you?

[00:38:14] Oh, yeah.

[00:38:15] Yeah.

[00:38:16] Yeah, you go ahead.

[00:38:17] It's Therapeutic Podcast, my guy.

[00:38:20] I like how you touched on something in regards to the business and not just it being a business.

[00:38:26] Everybody knows just transactional elements.

[00:38:28] There's a context to it.

[00:38:30] And to me, I don't think it's not only as long as I think we have a policy of the amount of people that can convey the opportunity and what is actually happening to college to this in general, but very particularly college at the level.

[00:38:59] One thing that really fascinates me is the ability to do something and then to bring in crowds.

[00:39:07] Right.

[00:39:08] That's actually what's happening.

[00:39:10] And so when you see that, yeah, they will pump us up as athletes.

[00:39:16] You know, let me not say it.

[00:39:21] Let me particularly say it because this is a question I want to pose for basketball.

[00:39:25] I want to pose for basketball.

[00:39:26] That's something that it can be.

[00:39:29] And it's changed a little bit with NIL, but I can't imagine the amount of, you know, there's trauma even in going through that.

[00:39:44] Because you're being put on a pedestal to generate money.

[00:39:50] And I'm anticipating, I'm going back to the NIL, gave me luck at examples like University of Miami.

[00:39:58] The actual academic part of the university was built on the phone.

[00:40:04] Mm-hmm.

[00:40:05] And I can't imagine the people that didn't go to the NFL.

[00:40:08] You went to the NFL and had average careers.

[00:40:13] So they go back to their campus and like, this is what was built.

[00:40:18] These things.

[00:40:19] Based on, you know, all of the hits and conclusions I took.

[00:40:23] And what's my purpose now?

[00:40:26] Are they remembering me?

[00:40:28] These PhDs.

[00:40:30] These grants.

[00:40:32] Based on what excitement into that arena I would see.

[00:40:37] Mm-hmm.

[00:40:39] And so it's like, if you don't have somebody that can speak inspiration and context and tell you what opportunity to live there while you're in the movement.

[00:40:50] It's doing us such a disservice.

[00:40:53] Because we're meant to think that we are the reason so sweet.

[00:40:59] The reason is something totally malicious.

[00:41:02] Can I throw something onto that?

[00:41:05] No way.

[00:41:06] Although there's anything.

[00:41:07] It can be malicious.

[00:41:09] Although there's an upside.

[00:41:10] There's definitely so many blessings that can come up.

[00:41:12] But if you're not told what's happening to you, there's a malicious element.

[00:41:18] And there's a trauma that one would have to experience after that.

[00:41:24] Richard, I'm going to throw a word in there.

[00:41:27] I'm going to throw a word on top of what you're saying.

[00:41:29] And RJ, I would like to even see what your response is.

[00:41:32] Isn't that Mandingo behavior?

[00:41:34] Going back to slavery.

[00:41:35] Isn't that part?

[00:41:36] You alluded to the Coliseum with the...

[00:41:38] The plantation mentality.

[00:41:40] Exactly.

[00:41:43] I do believe it's a piece of that, yes.

[00:41:49] And I don't know if I want to speak to it necessarily.

[00:41:52] Because I think it diverges the fact that we all kind of have this mentality.

[00:41:56] And I can only speak for football.

[00:41:58] That you just come into work.

[00:42:00] So my story is a little different, obviously, from Gerard and Todd.

[00:42:04] I didn't go to the bigger school.

[00:42:05] It's one of those, you got offers to go to the big school.

[00:42:08] But I would have been a prop for those who know who get it.

[00:42:10] I didn't want to wait.

[00:42:12] So I went to a small Lambeth University who just put Ron Dixon in the league.

[00:42:18] Who ran a kickoff return for the Giants in the Super Bowl.

[00:42:21] So I'm replacing that guy.

[00:42:25] So when I came in, you just have the mentality that I'm a small fish.

[00:42:31] Everybody's all state in college.

[00:42:33] Everybody's all region.

[00:42:34] Everybody was their coach's favorite.

[00:42:36] You learn in college, the coach chooses those accolades anyway.

[00:42:40] So they don't mean nothing either.

[00:42:42] Oh, you was on a magazine.

[00:42:44] The coach chooses that too.

[00:42:45] His little favorites go up and do that.

[00:42:47] So you go to college.

[00:42:48] And it's just everybody's hometown that you're kind of representing on your back.

[00:42:54] So you have the mentality when you get there.

[00:42:57] I'm just going to work and figure it out.

[00:42:59] Number one.

[00:43:00] Number two, when I went to college, I was 17.

[00:43:03] So I couldn't even go to the club and kick it with everybody.

[00:43:06] So a lot of times I was by myself because after I would start in the game, I wasn't old

[00:43:11] enough to get in the club.

[00:43:12] So I'm back on campus.

[00:43:14] Super low.

[00:43:15] Bro, they didn't sneak you in like they used to do me.

[00:43:17] I was 17 when I got to college too.

[00:43:19] Bro, they tried to.

[00:43:20] They tried.

[00:43:21] But I'm in a small school, right?

[00:43:23] True, true.

[00:43:24] So this is Jackson, Tennessee.

[00:43:25] I'm at a small private Methodist school.

[00:43:28] I didn't even know nothing about that when I went.

[00:43:30] And at times, Rich, like you said, the machine that's there that builds the entire school from

[00:43:39] the football program.

[00:43:41] We had the teachers fighting against that because they wanted to continue to be known as an academic

[00:43:46] university.

[00:43:47] So the money that could have been there that generated the funds, the faculty thought it.

[00:43:53] Before Hugh Freeze went to Ole Miss, he was at Lambeth.

[00:43:58] Like, I can give you names of people that came through the Lambeth doors that's professional

[00:44:03] in college and making major waves came from us.

[00:44:07] And we didn't have the support of the university.

[00:44:10] We didn't have the support, in my opinion.

[00:44:11] We didn't have that support.

[00:44:13] So the school ended up tanking and is now a part of University of Memphis now.

[00:44:18] So Lambeth-

[00:44:19] I didn't know that.

[00:44:20] So Lambeth is gone.

[00:44:21] Yeah, that's what I heard.

[00:44:22] It's a part of University of Memphis now.

[00:44:26] Yeah, and we had baseball players.

[00:44:29] Shout out to one of my best friends, Rashad Smith.

[00:44:32] Played for the Padres, got drafted.

[00:44:34] Baseball, like, and he was also my quarterback.

[00:44:36] Like, you have the mentality that we're here to work anyway.

[00:44:39] So as you're going through these extremes, two a days, whatever, however terrible your

[00:44:45] facilities are, you just figure it out.

[00:44:47] And that's your mindset.

[00:44:49] Oh, it's 100 degrees.

[00:44:50] They go for every pound you lose.

[00:44:52] You got to replace that in water.

[00:44:53] So it's just like, okay, we're assuming you know what you're doing, one.

[00:44:57] Or two.

[00:44:58] I don't know what number I'm on.

[00:44:59] Also, if you don't have anybody that's been to college before you, you just kind of assume

[00:45:06] everybody's knowing what they're doing because you're figuring it out for your tribe, for

[00:45:10] your family.

[00:45:11] So when you're the pride of the family and you're the first one there, you really don't

[00:45:15] know to ask the question.

[00:45:18] Richard, I like what you said about knowing that you could be the GM.

[00:45:20] What I saw is after you graduate, if you don't go pro, you become a grad assistant.

[00:45:25] If you want to stay around the game, you just become a grad assistant.

[00:45:28] You coach on the team, you do something like that and you figure it out.

[00:45:32] So part of me was I didn't want to be like when I separated from my first love is what

[00:45:37] I called it.

[00:45:37] When I separated from my first love, I didn't want to be associated with football at all

[00:45:42] because I didn't want to feel like football made me.

[00:45:45] Oh, I'm right there with you.

[00:45:46] That was me saying.

[00:45:48] So where some people became a grad assistant, I saw that as a weak thing.

[00:45:52] Like, yeah, I could do that, but I want to make it on my own still because that's been

[00:45:56] my identity since I got here.

[00:45:58] Y'all didn't know me for real.

[00:46:00] It was a lot just with it.

[00:46:03] So graduating and mine was parsed.

[00:46:07] So I went there for three years, very highly, highly touted.

[00:46:12] The Cowboys came by, worked me out in the spring, all this stuff.

[00:46:16] Got into my senior year.

[00:46:18] My daddy's kidneys failed and ended up red shirting and not coming back for two years.

[00:46:23] Because it's an NAI school, I'm not on the same clock.

[00:46:26] So I can go back after my clearinghouse or whatever would have been done and played my last

[00:46:31] season.

[00:46:32] So a lot of things happened to me that was more like a tenacity thing.

[00:46:36] Coming back, fight, fight, fight.

[00:46:38] Don't really ask no questions.

[00:46:39] Forget the information.

[00:46:40] I just need to graduate.

[00:46:42] So the mentality, I think, of the athlete at the time, speaking for my situation, doesn't

[00:46:49] necessarily speak to the education and all of the variety of opportunities that you have.

[00:46:58] At some point, it's just finish.

[00:47:00] That's what we do.

[00:47:01] We come, we work, and we finish.

[00:47:03] And I'll figure everything else out when I get there.

[00:47:07] Yeah, that's right.

[00:47:10] You know, I know a lot of people, first time they ever went to the university is the first

[00:47:14] time anyone in their family has been.

[00:47:16] And the biggest thing for you to do is to finish.

[00:47:21] Instead of finishing well or finish with a goal in mind of, hey, I want to be this or prepare

[00:47:27] yourself while you have all of these influential people that are around you, you know, making

[00:47:35] connections so that once you leave, you're set up for success.

[00:47:38] You're just trying to finish.

[00:47:39] Finish.

[00:47:40] We don't know.

[00:47:40] If no one's telling you that, network.

[00:47:43] You know, meet these.

[00:47:43] This will be the best time in your life to meet these individuals.

[00:47:47] Right?

[00:47:48] And if no one's telling you that, you're just trying to, what?

[00:47:51] Finish.

[00:47:52] And so once you get finished, all of that's finished, too.

[00:47:56] Because once you get done, you know, they don't look at you the same.

[00:47:59] You're not on the team.

[00:48:00] You can't really do anything for them anymore.

[00:48:02] They can't show you off to their friends like you talk about the Mandingo stuff.

[00:48:07] You know what I mean?

[00:48:08] They can't show you off.

[00:48:09] I remember back when I was getting recruited, I went to Alabama.

[00:48:12] And then my recruit visit there, one of the coaches came and, like, put me on the shoulders.

[00:48:18] Like, oh, yeah, you got a good frame.

[00:48:20] We can put weight on him.

[00:48:21] My mom was looking like, hey, this is getting a car.

[00:48:25] She's like, they trying to treat you like a slave, wasn't it, son?

[00:48:28] You know?

[00:48:29] And I'm like, I never really thought about it that way.

[00:48:31] But, you know, just looking at you, they just didn't open your mouth and look at your teeth.

[00:48:35] You know what I mean?

[00:48:36] Yeah.

[00:48:39] It's one of those things where, you know, you have to make the system work for you.

[00:48:43] But if you don't know how to do that and you never had anyone that's done that before, then you don't know what you're missing.

[00:48:51] You know what I mean?

[00:48:52] I feel like all of us who have children out there, play a sport or anything, and they make it to the next level,

[00:48:57] and we will be able to let them know, like, hey, you need to take this very seriously.

[00:49:03] You know what I mean?

[00:49:04] And then know how this thing works really well.

[00:49:09] Can I – I think the whole conversation has me thinking about the other aspect, too.

[00:49:15] Like, say you did get to the league, right?

[00:49:18] Say you got to the NFL, got to the NBA or whatever.

[00:49:20] And the average career is around three and a half years for each respect and sport.

[00:49:26] But, I mean, for all intents and purposes, we call all these people successes.

[00:49:30] Like, they were at the creme de la creme in their profession for whatever specific time they were able to do it at that level.

[00:49:38] And – but then the next question is, how – for all those people who have an average career of whatever length,

[00:49:45] within three and a half years, they're filing for bankruptcy.

[00:49:49] There's a good portion that are also doing that.

[00:49:53] And it just – to me, it goes to show you that it's not just about the high school or the collegiate.

[00:49:59] It's the profession.

[00:50:00] Like, when you're done with this thing, where do you want to be?

[00:50:04] What is your trajectory?

[00:50:06] Sometimes when you're – one of the things that I hate the most is when I hear broadcasters say,

[00:50:12] oh, man, number 22 is such a good kid.

[00:50:14] He's a great kid out there.

[00:50:16] Look at him do it.

[00:50:16] You guys have all heard that when they refer to an athlete, a football player, a basketball player, whatever, as a kid.

[00:50:21] These are men with children or they're females with marriage and all that.

[00:50:25] Whatever it is.

[00:50:26] We're not all kids.

[00:50:27] It's – but there's a – but there's a – some – there's a schema in society where it says, if you are playing this game,

[00:50:34] it is a childlike feat, so we're going to make you an amateur and you're a kid.

[00:50:38] And that's how the NCAA got off for years, not paying college athletes what they deserved and all that stuff.

[00:50:44] But I think the hard part about that, if you adopt that kid mentality that's being projected upon you,

[00:50:54] you kind of divorce yourself or you delay the maturation that it requires to be able to see the economic mechanisms that are behind your sport,

[00:51:06] the macroeconomics, the microeconomics, the socioeconomics, and then ask yourself the big questions.

[00:51:12] In 10 to 20 years, who do I want to be based on these things?

[00:51:16] How do I – how do I want a nation built?

[00:51:19] How do I want a kingdom built?

[00:51:21] Can I do that in this sport at this salary?

[00:51:24] How is inflation going to look?

[00:51:26] How are the demands on the society going to change?

[00:51:29] All of those things drove me into radiology in terms of being a doctor.

[00:51:36] You have to ask these questions because you have to look at how society is now.

[00:51:40] When you leave your sport, what are your medical bills going to be looking like?

[00:51:43] What are your bills in terms of depression?

[00:51:46] Do you have a therapist?

[00:51:47] Do you have life insurance to help support your family if you're not going to be there?

[00:51:54] Heaven forbid you go through what Junior Seau did and all that.

[00:51:57] So these – it is a very deep, deep, deep well because you can – I can't look at somebody in the NFL and say, oh, they weren't – they were damn successful just because they don't have money now.

[00:52:11] It's like they never – they had that delay.

[00:52:14] They never had to answer those serious questions of who do I want to be.

[00:52:19] And then you have those people always – the hangers on.

[00:52:22] I don't want to say hangers.

[00:52:22] That's not fair.

[00:52:23] But we all have bigger, broader responsibilities to our families the more we come into it because with great power comes great responsibility.

[00:52:30] So you have to learn how to balance all those things and still help others but not sink your own ship at the same time so that your family still has – but I'm sorry.

[00:52:40] I'm going on – I'm being redundant.

[00:52:42] I'm just saying this is powerful stuff, man.

[00:52:45] Ray, what you're saying, Ray, I like it a lot.

[00:52:48] But there's so many dynamics to what you said.

[00:52:50] I want to challenge a little bit of it too.

[00:52:52] Just with the childlike mentality first.

[00:52:56] I think part of that you kind of have to adopt as an athlete too, especially when you're going into college brand new because like that privilege to keep that mindset that you're talking about is really only reserved for like the best of the best, the highest recruited person.

[00:53:18] Because the rest of us are just trying to make 53.

[00:53:23] So you get there and it's like, okay, I would rather play corner, but if I go over here and play offense, I could start.

[00:53:34] So am I going to sit behind Eric Berry, no disrespect, or am I going to switch and play strong safety?

[00:53:43] Or am I going to play instead of free safety?

[00:53:46] Or play slot receiver?

[00:53:49] So you have to be kind of with the – do y'all curse?

[00:53:54] I don't want to –

[00:53:55] Dude, I haven't.

[00:53:57] I've dropped whatever.

[00:53:58] Y'all be with the shit, right?

[00:53:58] Just because – so I went to college in 2000, born in 82.

[00:54:05] Back when football, they were still cussing you out.

[00:54:08] So you kind of are used to – and I'm from the South.

[00:54:12] I don't know where everybody's from.

[00:54:13] But down here, there was kind of a way that football players were.

[00:54:16] There was a culture that was there.

[00:54:18] And everybody don't respond to cussing, but depending on your position, quarterbacks don't get that.

[00:54:22] You learn that more when you go to college.

[00:54:25] And it's like, oh, they nice to him, but I'm going to catch hell.

[00:54:28] So they throw a bad pass, but it's on me.

[00:54:30] You learn that kind of stuff.

[00:54:31] So if you don't keep a malleable mindset through the process before they recognize that you him,

[00:54:38] which I eventually feel like I became, you won't survive, honestly.

[00:54:45] You can be opinionated, and they're going to recruit a five-star right behind you the next year.

[00:54:52] And football politics is comparable, if not worse, than actual politics, in my opinion,

[00:54:58] because you'll be better.

[00:55:00] That rating system is hell.

[00:55:01] That guy who plays.

[00:55:03] It depends on who they like more who plays.

[00:55:06] Yep.

[00:55:07] Oh, man.

[00:55:09] That's speaking to the choir right there, especially with football.

[00:55:12] Them damn star system.

[00:55:17] What was it?

[00:55:18] Rivals when we came through.

[00:55:19] That a key.

[00:55:21] Every time.

[00:55:31] It would be that serious.

[00:55:32] And everybody would be that close.

[00:55:33] Everybody's out there doing their best and working hard.

[00:55:37] And you have to look at the guys.

[00:55:38] It's always in a coach's locker room.

[00:55:39] Like, you learn so much about life.

[00:55:43] Oh, yeah.

[00:55:44] Just on the field.

[00:55:46] Yeah.

[00:55:47] So if you don't keep that kind of mentality to just be flexible, it could take you out.

[00:55:53] I guess that's the part that I wanted to just challenge a little bit.

[00:55:58] Yeah.

[00:55:59] Yeah.

[00:56:00] I appreciate that challenge.

[00:56:01] And I just wanted to say, when I used the word kid, like, I wasn't...

[00:56:05] I'm not trying to say that the athlete is a child and, you know, they'll never grow.

[00:56:10] So all I'm saying is the society at large, right?

[00:56:15] And this was because I brought up the Mandingoism earlier.

[00:56:18] Richard alluded to being kind of a gladiatorial mindset being in the Coliseum.

[00:56:25] You're competing because you're in your world and you're doing what you got to do to survive.

[00:56:29] And it makes sense.

[00:56:32] But my bad.

[00:56:33] I might be talking too.

[00:56:35] Hey, look.

[00:56:36] It's the Grammy.

[00:56:38] We'll have a part two.

[00:56:39] You know what I mean?

[00:56:40] Yeah.

[00:56:41] Obviously, the outro music is playing, right?

[00:56:44] Because we literally have an hour.

[00:56:47] Look, I didn't even get to some other things that I wanted us to get to.

[00:56:50] But that's okay.

[00:56:51] We didn't want to get conversation, man.

[00:56:52] That's okay.

[00:56:53] But anyway, for those who don't know, at the end of our show,

[00:56:58] we always let everybody say something to leave the people with a little something.

[00:57:03] So I'm going to go around the room here.

[00:57:06] We're going to start with you, Gerard.

[00:57:08] Go ahead.

[00:57:09] Yeah, man.

[00:57:10] Great conversation for you guys.

[00:57:12] You know, leave you with something I like to tell people at times.

[00:57:15] You know, when it comes to sports, and at the end for me, it was one of my...

[00:57:21] What some people would say was one of my greatest accomplishments, was one of my greatest failures in my eyes,

[00:57:26] because I didn't get the end where I wanted to.

[00:57:29] So you can just see the dichotomy of that at times, something that people would celebrate,

[00:57:33] and something that I'm just like, you know, shoulda, coulda, woulda type thing.

[00:57:38] So, I mean, it hits you hard, man.

[00:57:40] It's definitely a therapeutic thing that you talk with friends about.

[00:57:46] So, I mean, I appreciate you guys being able to listen and listen to your stories as well,

[00:57:50] because it's strong, and that's what we're here for.

[00:57:53] And if anybody else has any stories out there that they'd like to share,

[00:57:57] when you hear this, just know that we're here.

[00:58:00] We want to listen and hear your thoughts.

[00:58:02] So, that's what I just wanted to share here at the end.

[00:58:05] Awesome.

[00:58:06] Yeah, y'all can contact us at bgtcast at gmail.com if you want to reach out.

[00:58:11] We're here.

[00:58:13] All right.

[00:58:13] Go ahead, Ray.

[00:58:14] I just want to say thank y'all for having me.

[00:58:18] Didn't know this conversation was going to hit as strong as it did,

[00:58:21] but, I mean, we got great people in this room, and just glad to be amongst you guys, man.

[00:58:29] Rich, knock it out.

[00:58:31] So, my residential...

[00:59:47] I'll try to be as short and sweet as possible.

[00:59:52] Get your rest.

[00:59:54] Learn to manage money.

[00:59:56] And tell everybody that you love that you love them.

[00:59:59] They'll be here today.

[01:00:00] Gone tomorrow, just like that.

[01:00:02] When you have these times to share with people that you care about,

[01:00:06] you go through those two-a-days, whatever struggle you go through,

[01:00:10] everybody's fighting for the same success.

[01:00:13] Just let people know why you got them, how you feel.

[01:00:16] Because it matters.

[01:00:19] Thank y'all for having me.

[01:00:21] Absolutely.

[01:00:23] Well, I'll let us end here, right?

[01:00:27] Thanks, everybody who showed up today.

[01:00:30] I mean, I would thank Gerard, but he's supposed to be here.

[01:00:33] He's on contract.

[01:00:35] But everybody else, I appreciate y'all showing up.

[01:00:38] It is great to have y'all.

[01:00:40] And don't be a stranger to this space.

[01:00:45] Again, we're 3 Peter Podcast, and we're here every week.

[01:00:48] Hopefully, Lord willing, right?

[01:00:52] In case, or hopefully nothing crazy happens and Uncle Sam calls me.

[01:00:56] But anyway, that's another story.

[01:00:59] Thank y'all.

[01:01:01] I needed this.

[01:01:02] It's funny because we talk about this and we go back in time and we're having these feelings

[01:01:06] and they come back up and you just don't know how to sometimes process them.

[01:01:09] But it's good to talk them out.

[01:01:13] Be on the lookout for more episodes from us.

[01:01:16] Like I said, we usually drop every Monday.

[01:01:19] I think that was the cadence before.

[01:01:21] We're going to try to keep that same cadence every Monday.

[01:01:25] Thanks for the people who have been listening to our old episodes on repeat, man.

[01:01:29] That's awesome.

[01:01:30] We have not been on in a year and we still have a cult following.

[01:01:37] And I'm proud of that.

[01:01:38] So hopefully we can continue to do this.

[01:01:41] Season two.

[01:01:42] Yeah, I know, right?

[01:01:43] This is season two, right?

[01:01:45] So we're here.

[01:01:46] We're going to try to keep bringing y'all the hot fire like Dylon, right?

[01:01:50] We're going to keep bringing that stuff.

[01:01:53] But yeah, all I say is y'all be good.

[01:01:58] Love on the ones that you love and love on the ones that you can.

[01:02:01] And we'll see y'all next time.

[01:02:03] So with nothing else, we out.

[01:02:05] Rap.

[01:02:06] Thank y'all.

[01:02:07] Peace.